Last night, Glenn Beck had me on his TV show to discuss Iran’s nuclear program and the future of U.S.-Israel relations. Here is the transcript:
GLENN BECK: Something else happened today which was our stance now on Iran has dramatically changed yet again. Just a few months ago under Bush, no talks ever. It has always been that way since 1979. Then President Obama said, “Well, let’s start with some conditions.” And now, the Obama administration is about to drop even that condition. “Well, let’s just talk, even if you have a nuclear thing, whatever. Let’s sit down and talk.” Joel Rosenberg is here. Joel Rosenberg is the author of “Inside the Revolution.” Joel, I don’t even know where to start with this one other than I guess maybe with an interview that I did with Benjamin Netanyahu about two years ago and I said, “You guys are being set up.” And he said, “What do you mean?” I said, “I think the world is going to start pushing towards, `Oh, let’s just be friends with Iran.’” This was way before Barack Obama. And I said they’re going to lose the window. Everybody is going to push for peace, and then you’re going to have to go in because you can’t let these nut jobs have these weapons. And you guys are going to be deemed the bad guys and the rest of the world will pound you. And he said, “Well, be it as it may but we have a right to survive.” Do you think that scenario is coming true?
JOEL ROSENBERG, AUTHOR, “INSIDE THE REVOLUTION”: It is coming to fruition. I think this is a very bad scenario right now, Glenn. Yet the prime minister of Israel Netanyahu understands that there is an apocalyptic, genocidal death cult running Iran right now….They are determined to get the nuclear weapons and destroy Israel. As we talked about before, Israel is only the little Satan. The United States is the great Satan. And as I quote extensively in the book, the president of Iran and top leaders of Iran want to annihilate the United States. And the idea that we will drop this pre-condition and not force Iran to stop enriching uranium before we sit down and talk is a huge mistake. I would describe it as appeasement.
BECK: How did you describe — an apocalyptic what?
ROSENBERG: An apocalyptic, genocidal death cult is running Iran today.
BECK: No, that’s weird, because I think that’s the way that NBC News the media describes my audience. I’m not really sure. You know, people don’t –
ROSENBERG: But you’re not building nuclear weapons. There’s a difference, see.
BECK: Not that you know. Joel, here is the thing that I don’t think people understand. It was about three years ago that I read someplace about the 12th imam. And I went — wait a minute. Wait a minute. Who’s the 12th imam? And I started looking into it because Ahmadinejad always ends his speeches at the United Nations with “Oh, Allah, give me the strength to hasten the return of the promised one.” When you say apocalyptic, genocidal death cult, you’re not kidding. I want you to explain that and then explain why people in our country – the state department seem to have a problem with religion except over in the Middle East with crazy people. More on that next.
BECK: Author of “Inside the Revolution,” Joel Rosenberg, is back with us. OK. We were talking about why we can’t let Iran get nuclear weapons. And most people will say, “Oh, come on. France has nuclear weapons.”
These people aren’t French. At least, the people currently running it. You say, they’re apocalyptic genocidal maniacs. Is that what it was?
ROSENBERG: Yes….death cult leaders.
BECK: Yes, that’s right. Death cult….
ROSENBERG: Death cult leaders.
BECK: Right. Explain what that means.
ROSENBERG: Yes. Well, as I describe it in “Inside the Revolution” in quite a bit of detail, the leaders of Iran believe that the end of the world is here. They believe that the Islamic messiah, the 12th Imam, is coming imminently – that’s the word they’re using, “imminent.” And they believe their mission in life is to hasten or speed up the coming of the Islamic messiah by destroying Judeo-Christian civilizations as we know it.
BECK: OK. So if I may put this in Christian terms, if you’re somebody who believes in end-times prophecy, you know, that Jesus is coming and the 7-year tribulation and everything else. And you’d be like, “You know, know what? I think we can get this done in two-and-a-half years if we just — we can make this happen. We’ll just hurry up and make things chaotic.” That’s what they believe, that there needs to be great chaos here, and -
ROSENBERG: That’s right.
BECK: And Muslim blood flowing through the streets, et cetera, et cetera.
ROSENBERG: That’s right.
BECK: And so they really, truly believe that it would be best for Islam and best for Allah if they would just hurry that up. Why wait?
ROSENBERG: That’s the problem. We’ve never had a nation’s leadership in any part of the world at any time in history have the death cult features that the Iran leadership has now.
BECK: True or false – go ahead.
ROSENBERG: Well, I was just going to say, Prime Minister Netanyahu understands this.
ROSENBERG: I’ve talked to him about it.
BECK: I have, too.
ROSENBERG: I quote him in the book. But our administration does not. And I believe a train wreck is coming between the United States and Israel over how to handle Iran.
BECK: Thank you.
ROSENBERG: This is the worst moment in U.S.-Israel relations in 61 years.
BECK: I agree with you. America, we cannot abandon — I mean, just — you cannot abandon Israel on this one. You have to understand the religious zealots that are over there.
I don’t understand why in our country we have the left that are so afraid of anybody in a church even saying anything about – you can’t say “God” in schools because that is going to – but they will completely dismiss people.
And this isn’t all of the people in Iran. Understand this…
ROSENBERG: Exactly right.
BECK: These are people that are in charge right now, specifically Ahmadinejad, and even the Ayatollah Khomeini thought this cult which now controls the government, was so dangerous — true or false — he executed them. He wanted them wiped out because the ayatollah said they were too crazy.
ROSENBERG: He certainly wanted them banned. And look, I am an evangelical Christian. And I believe in end-times prophecy. But Jesus’ end-times prophecy is that we’re supposed to go out and share the gospel and try to save tens of millions of people.
Whereas apocalyptic Shia Muslim eschatology or end-times theology says to kill all the Jews and Christians or convert them to Islam. And that’s the danger is that the current administration doesn’t understand it.
BECK: So what do you do?
ROSENBERG: One of the reasons I wrote the book is to try to help Washington understand it.
BECK: So what do you do? What is the solution here?
ROSENBERG: Well, it depends if you’re talking about the American government.
BECK: The American government?
ROSENBERG: The American government has to understand who is across the table. And they have to make a choice. The top experts believe Iran will have nuclear weapons within a year – year and a half, tops.
ROSENBERG: So if you ever talk to them, you better understand who you’re dealing with. But personally, I believe we’re out of time. And I believe North Korea is the evidence. We have been talking to North Korea in six-party talks for 10 years, and where are we?
They have their first nuclear weapon tested. They have an intercontinental ballistic missile that they have tested. Fifteen Iranian military advisors were at that launch last weekend. And now, they are restarting their nuclear arms program.
When you’re talking with two genocidal maniacs, talking won’t work. And unfortunately, we are headed into war with Iran. Either the United States will launch it to protect western civilization or Israel will …
BECK: Israel will.
ROSENBERG: … unless there is an act of God, there is a crisis coming of biblical proportions.
BECK: OK. Joel, you don’t have to end it that way, geez, for the love of — smile, lollipops — things are going to be great. Joel, thanks a lot. We’ll talk again.